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Sports / Re: NBA 2018-19
« Last post by Solon on Today at 08:36:23 AM »
Last night the Toronto Raptors, without their best player Kawhi Leonard, beat the Golden State Warriors. I mean they BEAT them. It was an exhibition of shooting, passing, running the floor, and defense that makes them at this point look like the better team. GS has had some bad nights because of injuries but last night none of that applied. The Raptors are 7-1 since Leonard went down and demonstrated why they have the best record in the NBA.
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Religion / Re: Why do we think we go to Heaven (or Hell) when we die?
« Last post by Bill Wyatt on December 12, 2018, 02:58:17 PM »
This is the Methodists take on it... a firm "we don't know."

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Many Christians through the centuries have believed that when persons die, they remain dead (asleep) until the final judgment, at which time they are resurrected to life or punishment. Scripture references in both the Old and New Testaments seem to agree with the position that we remain asleep/dead until the final judgment. Other Biblical passages, such as Jesus' words to the thief on the cross "today you will be with me in paradise" (Luke 23:43), seem to indicate that we go to be with God immediately at the point of death.You may hear a pastor at a funeral today speak as if we go to be with the Lord immediately.

UM Reporter interviewed Thomas G. Long, professor at Candler School of Theology, about his new book on funerals. To the question of how we should think about what’s happened to the dead, he said,

“There are two images in the New Testament about what happens. First, the Resurrection Day, when the trumpet will sound and the dead will be raised up incorruptible. If you only had that image, what we would imagine is that when people die, they lie in some intermediate state awaiting the great Resurrection Day.

The other image, however, is that death contains no victory over us at all. As soon as we die, we are with God. We get this in the Book of Revelation where John looks up and already the saints who have died are praising God around the throne. In terms of linear time, we can’t work this out. We’ve got these two competing images: You either wait until the general resurrection or you go immediately to be with God.

But the imposition of linear time on what is an eternal idea is what creates the contradiction. I don’t try to make a theologian out of Einstein, but he did show us that events that happen in sequence can also be events that happen simultaneously. If Einstein can imagine that in terms of physics, theologians can imagine it also in terms of the intrusion of eternity into linear time—that we are both immediately raised and raised together.”

http://www.umc.org/what-we-believe/what-happens-after-a-person-dies
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Religion / Why do we think we go to Heaven (or Hell) when we die?
« Last post by Bill Wyatt on December 12, 2018, 10:13:05 AM »
It's certainly not biblical. I would love to hear anyone's thoughts on this...

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John 3:13
(13) No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of Man who is in heaven.
New King James Version.

Perhaps no other doctrine more clearly exposes the effectiveness and thoroughness of Satan's deception of the whole world (Revelation 12:9). Jesus plainly states in John 3:13, "No one has ascended to heaven but He who came down from heaven, that is, the Son of man who is in heaven." Yet, most of the Christian world believes that immediately upon death a person's soul wafts off to heaven to be with others of the dearly departed.

This verse does not stand alone; many scriptures confirm Jesus' testimony. Peter says regarding the highly respected, man-after-God's-own-heart David, ". . . he is both dead and buried, and his tomb is with us to this day. . . . For David did not ascend into the heavens . . ." (Acts 2:29, 34).

Other scriptures remind us that, when a person dies, he is without consciousness:

For the living know that they will die; but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten. . . . Whatever your hand finds to do, do it with your might; for there is no work or device or knowledge or wisdom in the grave where you are going. (Ecclesiastes 9:5, 10)

Psalm 146:3-4 adds, "Do not put your trust in princes, nor in a son of man, in whom there is no help. His spirit departs, he returns to his earth; in that very day his plans [thoughts, KJV] perish."

Jesus identifies Himself in Revelation 1:18 as, "I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen." He says something similar as He begins His message to the church at Smyrna: "These things says the First and the Last, who was dead, and came to life" Revelation 2:8. Who are we to believe, a God who never lies or the tales of false prophets? Was Jesus telling the truth when He said He was dead - that He was not off in heaven during those three days and three nights, conversing with the Father, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Moses? If we believe the Bible, the answer is beyond question.

The gospel Jesus Christ brought reveals the Kingdom of God as the Christian hope. The Bible teaches that a person must remain in his grave, unaware of events in the conscious world, until a resurrection occurs, when his life is renewed (just as Jesus' was), his body is changed to spirit, and he enters God's Kingdom.

In I Corinthians 15:50-54, the apostle Paul teaches that the resurrection does not occur until Christ returns. Then, those who "died in Christ" will be resurrected from their graves with spiritual bodies, and the living saints will also be changed, "in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. . . . [T]he dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed" (verse 52).

Galatians 3:29 speaks about our reward: "And if you are Christ's, then you are Abraham's seed and heirs according to the promise," confirming that those who are true Christians - "in Christ" - will receive the same inheritance Abraham was promised. Romans 4:13 establishes beyond doubt what Abraham will inherit when he is resurrected: "For the promise that he would be the heir of the world was not to Abraham or to his seed through the law, but through the righteousness of faith."

Furthermore, regarding those who will be resurrected with Abraham, Revelation 5:10 adds, "[You] have made us kings and priests to our God; and we shall reign on the earth." Later, Revelation 11:15 says, "Then the seventh angel sounded: And there were loud voices in heaven, saying, 'The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdoms of our Lord and of His Christ, and He shall reign forever and ever!'"

Many centuries of pagan tradition have convinced people that heaven is their "home" and their reward when they die. Nevertheless, the biblical record is unassailable: God's Kingdom will be established on the earth He created for mankind, and it will be an everlasting Kingdom with Christ as its King.

In awe of what he saw, John declares in Revelation 21:1-4:

And I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. Then I, John, saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven [to the earth] from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, "Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people, and God Himself will be with them and be their God. And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying, and there shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away."

The Bible contains much more on this facet of the gospel. Yet, with just this small sampling of verses, there should be no doubt remaining that the gospel teaches that the inheritance of Christians is this earth.
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Politics / Trump v Intelligence
« Last post by Solon on December 12, 2018, 05:02:32 AM »
We should have known that Trump has trouble with accepting reality when we discovered he had filed for bankruptcy SIX times. That's a lot of unrealistic expectations confronting hard, cold facts. Fortunately, his dad or his dad's money was there to bail him out on most occasions. Too bad for us there is no fairy god father to deal with his delusions as president. His ample gut has proven to be a poor guide to the real world. The sooner this ignorant grifter is removed from office the safer the nation and the world will be.

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President Trump continues to reject the judgments of U.S. spy agencies on major foreign policy fronts, creating a dynamic in which intelligence analysts frequently see troubling gaps between the president’s public statements and the facts laid out for him in daily briefings on world events, current and former U.S. officials said.

...presidential distrust that once seemed confined mainly to the intelligence community’s assessments about Russia’s interference in the 2016 election has spread across a range of global issues. Among them are North Korea’s willingness to abandon its nuclear weapons program, Iran’s nuclear and regional ambitions, the existence and implications of global climate change, and the role of the Saudi crown prince in the killing of a dissident journalist.

Gap continues to widen between Trump and intelligence community on key issues
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/gap-continues-to-widen-between-trump-and-intelligence-community-on-key-issues/2018/12/11/23a02cb0-f8db-11e8-863c-9e2f864d47e7_story.html?fbclid=IwAR0GZ3LMBB0hBK-xqIwXsQO9g9YXa5Vtr60YUx2OKFWS5Nu4t2ENUGVG5cE&utm_term=.6f84c6503312
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Politics / No Collusion
« Last post by Solon on December 12, 2018, 05:00:14 AM »

In an interview, Mimi Rocah, formerly an assistant U.S. attorney for SDNY laid out the explanation why Trump could be charged with conspiracy to defraud the United States. All she needed to do was explain the legal conditions that define a conspiracy. There is enough evidence in the pubic domain to justify an indictment. Mueller, however, has so much more evidence to bring to the court.

Trump Keeps Saying “No Collusion” Because He Doesn’t Understand Collusion
https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2018/12/trump-collusion-law-conspiracy.html?fbclid=IwAR0PK07GZYSRiq67gicSerz0L9izs-rhBsoDdAF7Ua-OseIQoqXIHtTqIFE
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General Discussion / Re: Snowstorm
« Last post by huckabuck on December 11, 2018, 02:26:11 PM »
I love southern VA snow days.  Here one day, gone the next!!  Spent all day Sunday just sitting around getting greasy headed and cooking chili and cheesecake.  A perfect football watching day!  Lucked up and never lost power. Total snow amount was 17" in Chatmoss.  Worked from home Monday and cleared driveways in between conference calls.  Got a case of beer and a bag of chips in payment from one gracious neighbor. Back to work first thing this morning.  Roads clear and dry with the exception of some icy spots from snow melt frozen overnight. 
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Silver Screen / Re: Netflix
« Last post by Bill Wyatt on December 10, 2018, 06:22:17 PM »
This looks like it's going to be a good one ...kevin costner ...woody harrellson ... True story of the agents involved in the bonnie and clyde hunt ...

http://www.darkhorizons.com/first-photo-costner-harrelson-are-highwaymen/

My kinda stuff!
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Silver Screen / Re: Netflix
« Last post by Lazebone on December 10, 2018, 03:40:35 PM »
This looks like it's going to be a good one ...kevin costner ...woody harrellson ... True story of the agents involved in the bonnie and clyde hunt ...

http://www.darkhorizons.com/first-photo-costner-harrelson-are-highwaymen/
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Sports / Re: NFL
« Last post by Skinsguy on December 10, 2018, 03:19:12 PM »
I still watch, but my team sucks. Especially after all the injuries they've had this year.
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General Discussion / Re: Whopper at McDonalds for a Penny
« Last post by Skinsguy on December 10, 2018, 03:17:49 PM »
The closest Burger King for me is all the way on Wendover. I don't know how much money I'd wind up spending just to drive over there and back.
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